Labour – the new stupid party

The Monday Column

How many times can you write: ‘Labour is screwed’ before you give up and do something else? Whatever the limit is, there’s a good chance we’ve now reached it. You can tell because correspondents on Uncut and many other blogs and publications on the centre-left have given up saying it.

I mean, what’s the point? 

Labour’s direction of travel is now set for the next few years, certainly until after Brexit in 2019. In lieu of issuing Cassandra-like warnings about the lurch to the hard left, there is little else left to say or write. The unreality of contemporary Labour politics merits little serious analysis.

Of course, Jeremy Corbyn makes lots of speeches, but the content is invariably a reheated version of the same stump speech that he’s been making for the last thirty years (‘It’s not right that…’) There is little by the way of policy or strategy to scrutinise and discuss, with Corbyn’s recent Labour conference speech plumbing new depths of banality, culminating with a shout-out birthday greeting for Diane Abbott.

There is no attempt at widening Labour’s support base or providing a realistic programme for government. There is little to say about how an advanced market economy copes with Brexit and cultivates enough decently-paid jobs in a future of growing automation. Or how limitless demand for public services can be effectively managed and financed and our welfare state reformed so it provides affordable care for children and the elderly alike.

The mantra is simply ‘spend, don’t offend.’ There is no problem increasing public spending or extending public ownership cannot resolve. State-owned trains will never be late. The Royal Mail must be renationalised as a priority, apparently, just so the taxpayer can take on its pension fund deficit. Middle-class students’ university tuition will be eagerly paid for by working class young workers, (who themselves will never get the chance to go near a university).  Capital controls will ensure that jittery speculators and fund managers can’t rain on the socialist parade. 

Of course, the offer of ‘free stuff’ will not withstand a casual brush with the realities of government. But no-one seems to care about the small details any more. Even the Conservative Research Department must have given up keeping track of Labour’s open-ended spending commitments.

Corbyn is content to coast along – surfing June’s mediocre election result – sermonising away like the non-conformist clergyman he resembles, offering a mixture of piety and sincerity and abstract moralising.

He has little to say beyond encomiums about lifting the public sector pay cap or the general wonderfulness of state ownership. For all his faults, Ed Miliband managed to make a substantial speech every other week throughout his leadership. As a result, the online comment and analysis space boomed.

Sites like Shifting Ground, Speaker’s Chair and Left Foot Forward allowed the centre-left to have a proper conversation about how Labour should respond to losing in 2010 and moving on from the New Labour era. Alas, the first two have sadly ceased publishing, while the latter is a shadow of its former self.

The decline of centre and centre-left political blogs is inverse proportion to the rise of hard-left ‘news’ sites like The Canary and Skwawkbox. When the Morning Star – the one-time rag of the Communist Party – is taken seriously in Labour circles, we have fallen far.

The lack of intellectual fizz around the party – the absence of bright ideas and new thinking – is anomalous given that ideology has come roaring back into fashion. But it’s a depressing, stale combination of 1950’s command economics and 1970s agit-prop, mixed together with po-faced identity politics. 

Yet the mass delusion persists.

The only discernible strategy from the leadership remains one of ‘build it and they will come.’ To be fair, a good portion of usually reluctant younger voters did just that back in June, yet for all the hubris, there is little evidence that a sea change has actually taken place in British politics. Labour is heading into its eighth year in opposition with just four more seats than Gordon Brown managed in 2010. 

So writing about Labour politics these days feels like a forlorn pursuit. Critiquing idiocy feels like a form of idiocy itself. 

JS Mill famously referred to the Conservatives as ‘the stupid party.’ Given the shambles they are making of Brexit, that epithet is still apt. However, watch for the Tories emerging triumphant from the inevitable post-Brexit recalibration of British politics. 

The racing form suggests even a bloodied and battered Conservative party stands a better chance of reinventing itself than a divided Labour party, wrestling over questions like whether anti-Semitism is justified and the merits and demerits of Marxist political economy; as the Corbynistas continues their strategy of terraforming a new hard left politics at the grassroots.

In the corner, moderate MPs cower – leaderless and directionless – hoping to avoid the executioner’s axe if they either curl into a ball or ape the platitudes of the hard left, as they hope for better times.

This, then, is the state we’re in. 

A political movement once dedicated to the pursuit of power in order to improve the interests of the British working class is now occupied by privately-educated Marxists and tin pot revolutionaries, intent on destroying the greatest vehicle for social and economic progress in British history.

How did it come to this? How did Labour become the new stupid party?

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44 Responses to “Labour – the new stupid party”

  1. James Branch says:

    Why don’t you join the Tories, and let true Labour members get on with getting a socialist Labour government elected. Instead of the neoliberal Blairism that has long been discredited. Stop living in the past.

  2. John P Reid says:

    What is going left, in the Cold War Unilateralism was left wing as having no deterrent when there was a enemy who’d like the country as a launch point to put weapons at America was left wing, the closed shop and flying pickets, where unions could block entrances to thd work place stopping those wanging to work enter , and opposing the public who’d voted to stay in a common market, by its own definition a capitalist club that saw the bosses, control the workers wages by buying cheaper elsewhere

    Whatever the manoeuvres of momentum to get power of conference it’s not undemocratic

    Yes the moderates message ,Labour May win. Election the young are too young to remember thd days when labour previously spent so much money, it got the country in debt and put labour out of power for 20 years, and rhe Tories could let labour in for s few years and then after labour causing debt be welcomed back in power for 50 years

    Yes Ed Miliband won because David didn’t understand how in popular new labour was, and Ed spending 5 years saying he wasn’t new labour , was his plan and rhd party supported it ,

    This article reads like sower grapes, what you fail to realise is as labour got its highest percentage of the vote since 2001( although Blair winning his third term with 37% seemed acceptable as Wilson won his 3rd rldction with 37% in 1974 too) is Corbynistas think they won the rldction an the next election in 202 if the Tories don’t get their act together , Corbyn could win again with about 42% of the vote, but the turnout will still be lower than any of the late 20th century , not enough for labour to be in power for long, but enough for Cotbynistas to convince themselves, there’s a mood to swing to the left on tax and telling the working class wgatvpolitical values they can have in minorities religions , yet the Islington lot in their middle class homes won’t have to see the crime caused by their middle class values , and labour will still lose votes in our traditional working class areas like Bolsover

  3. John P Reid says:

    The reason the SDP failed was they were never going to get the working class north from those who remember the labour movement after the war
    Yeh Corbynism is driving away the working class north more than Blairism ever did

  4. chris hankinson says:

    You state “The racing form suggests even a bloodied and battered Conservative party stands a better chance of reinventing itself than a divided Labour party” yet you are contributing to the division. As a 61 year old Socialist who has lived through many elections, whose house as a child was the Labour Party Committee rooms, who has met and heard Wilson through to Benn (older and younger) may I express my disgust at this article, which is full of bile and destructive. Why are you complaining about divisiveness and then adding to it. Why is there no analysis of current Labour economic policies/no answer to the ills that you perceive? To criticise without offering an alternative smacks, to me, of political and Socioeconomic ignorance and cowardice.

  5. Anon says:

    My God, how thick can some people be; even Matthew Goodwin, so-described ‘academic’, has realised that Brexit and Trump weren’t about filthy money or benefits, and that they were about identity and dignity.

    How do we reach a position where political parties believe that gradually replacing a demography will gain the votes of those being replaced?

    Or, that a nation can outsource its democracy to a bunch of technocratic parasites when the wrong political party achieves power?

    Or, that mere politicians (usually lawyers) have the power to tell the people of this country what they can’t say or do?
    New Labour’s regime of fingerprinting and DNA databasing, children, locking up people without charge, Common Purpose-trained snoopers on our councils – and in every department of our public offices – wars, Milburn-style greed, Mandelson/Campbell-style deceit – I could go on.

    None of this will change by moving from New Labour to New Messiah, Jeremy Corbyn – the bond between the Labour party and the beautiful people that I have lived my life amongst has been cut.

    The Tories may take our money, but Labour, New and old, has ripped the very soul out of this country.

  6. James Branch says:

    I’m sorry you can’t see the difference between Blair and Corbyn. Have you considered the possibility that you are thick. We are all beautiful people. Corbyn recognises the value of everyone, you obviously do not.

  7. Alf says:

    “In the corner, moderate MPs cower – leaderless and directionless… ”


  8. Christo says:

    Who is Labour Uncut? This article seems like an attack on the Party.
    If you find Jeremy Corbyn unacceptable maybe you should leave the Party and join another. I have never felt more optimistic of Labour’s chances

  9. buttley says:

    what a fabulously unhinged rant, like a Nick Cohen cameo.

    “improve the interests of the British working class”

    mandatory re-selections will begin this aim, such fun ahead.

  10. efcdons says:

    ” or providing a realistic programme for government.”

    I know. Especially when “realistic” means “things I like and nothing I don’t like”. I wonder if they will also fail to provide a “common sense” programme for government? Or a “credible” programme for government?

    Are there any other terms for “my personal preferences but dressed up like an objective analysis” I missed?

  11. Bay Whitaker says:

    What a bitter little article. Listen up -eventually you are either going to have to accept that nobody much cares about how horrid it is for you, and take up another hobby like gardening or am dram. Or you could swallow it down, accept the situation and start building bridges. Are you equal to the much more difficult task of winning people over who don’t want to be won over?

    If you have it in you, you could be the writer who gently makes the centre left case, and yes, it would be a slow long journey. You’d have to swallow that bile and treat others with respect instead of contempt. You’d have to ACTUALLY listen and try to hear, try to understand, rather than merely pretending to. You’d have to offer careful analysis with a dose of sensitivity. You’d have to find a way to love the joy and the enthusiasm the party has now, without feeling personally attacked by it.

    There is a third option – go on as you are now: be that bitter little voice carping in the corner, crying I Told You So at every set back. I expect this is the option you’ll choose.. But it’s gonna be bad for your mental health. mate, and if you have a family, it’ll be bad for them too.

    Gardening. Or perhaps a choir?

  12. Kent says:

    Is this the most stupid article ever? Aren’t you tied of rehashing the same rubbish for the last 3 years?

  13. paul barker says:

    I am a Libdem & I keep responding to articles like this with the same question : If this is your opinion why are you still Labour. Isnt it, finally, time to move on ?

  14. John Wall says:

    The responses to this piece are telling and there are pieces of mine that draw similar conclusions.

    Assuming – and it’s a big IF – that Brexit doesn’t go completely pear shaped, and with a replacement – I don’t know who – for Theresa May, I believe that the Conservatives are likely to be in a better position whenever the next election comes. This is because of the attitudes of the parties since June.

    The Conservatives increased their vote and percentage share but, for various reasons, lost their majority. Although, by every measure, they “won” the result was disappointing. Since then there have been in depth examinations to discover what went wrong and measures are being taken to sort out the party and develop better policies.

    On the Labour side, although there are exceptions, the overwhelming view has been triumphalist although, again by every measure, they lost and are still 60+ seats short of an overall majority. There appears to have been no, or very little, attempt to try and determine why they didn’t win against what – many Conservatives agree – was an extremely poor campaign. Nobody can deny that Labour did better than expected but there are no prizes for coming second. It’s difficult not to believe that the strategy to put Corbychev into Downing Street is, basically, “one more heave”.

    As far as the policies are concerned… It’s interesting to note that despite the Conservatives trying everything to alienate them, older voters overwhelmingly supported the blue corner. There was a split by age, for various reasons, but those who remembered where the country was heading in 1979 and where Labour wanted to take it in 1983 voted Conservative. The social care proposals (dementia tax) were only part of it, the triple lock was to become a double lock and the Winter Fuel Allowance was to be means tested – a triple whammy – but they still voted Conservative.

    Labour has become a cult, the manifesto is holy writ handed down on tablets of stone, and it’s stuck with the failed policies of the past that didn’t work then and won’t work now.

    Just before writing this I saw the latest opinion poll, from ICM, that put both major parties on 42% and that’s largely been the story of the last few months – both polling in the low 40s.

  15. john P reid says:

    Bay Whittaker has got it spot on, unless the hard left twig that labour didn’t win the election, and could at best win the next election, then lose heavily 4 years later and be out of power for a generation as the public massively reject us, or we lose next time, and then the infighting gets so bad with deselections, that three’s a SDP style split and that takes away say5% of the vote that helps the Tories, then the only way Cobrynistas will start to lose the hold on the party is the traditional working class vote goes up north and Corbynite labour Councillors lose their sets up north

    the nobody much cares quote Bay, put say’s it all, because Corbyn is as popular as he needs to be with his follower at the moment, its ironic that his followers some of whom are a nasty Clique who may show their true colours bullying people, would be the only way moderates could win, their argument, ,but do we really want to see bullying in public, that would lose us votes? when we could stick together and show the nasty attitude, that some of the hard left have shown over the years

  16. john P Reid says:

    Although I wouldn’t call him Corbychevr , John wall is unfortunately right

  17. Nathan F says:

    Surely even the most disenfranchised Blairite/Centrist has to admit that ground has been made since 2015?! Instead of wasting time writing what you hope to become self-fulfilling prophecies, why not engage in a positive manner with a rejuvenated party taking the fight to the Tories? You do not further your cause with this polemical nonsense .

  18. Tafia says:

    Labour is a broad church. The problem is it has become too broad church and the different factions cannot be reconciled without a civil war and an exodus of the losers.

    It is split:-

    1. North, midlands, Scotland and Wales interests versus those of the south and south east.
    2. Brexiters versus remainers.
    3. Corbynites versus Centrists versus Blairites.
    4. Suburban and rural socially conservative versus metropolitan socially liberal.
    5. Young versus old.
    6. Middle class interests and desires versus blue collar interests and desires.
    7. And by far and away the biggest and potentially the most damaging split of all – democratic socialists versus social democrats.

    There is no predictability to the splits – they are entirely random but every Labour voter and every Labour member belongs to one of every line. And you can see the splits as soon as you hear the words fascist, msygonist, homophobe, racist, xenophobe etc etc. It’s all getting rather cliched and sadder by the day.

  19. john P reid says:

    True Nathan F, but what ground have the Tories made since 2015?
    for the record in Stoke on trent, Gloria de Piero, Jon Cruddas and Denis Skinners constituencies, ground hasn’t made their majorities went down

  20. Anne says:

    Don’t agree with this piece.
    We have currently the worst Conservative government in modern times – it is a government that is supported mainly by the older population – not sure if this is culture (I have always voted this way), but they are certainly not addressing the problems of today – nhs, social care etc and, bye the way, these are issues which mostly affect this generation. They are also marking a complete mess of Brexit talks – if a deal is not reached and we go over a cliff edge then that will be catastrophic for our economy which underpins the amount that is available for the welfare state.
    Our train service is far from ideal. I am not saying that nationalisation is the answer but it has got to be better than what we have. The moderates should get on board. Ed Miliband is back generating ideas.

  21. John P Reid says:

    All I can say . Is at least progress
    know that no one outside their magazine care what they think

  22. steve says:

    John Wall ” it’s [Labour] stuck with the failed policies of the past that didn’t work then and won’t work now.

    Odd isn’t it how the anti-Corbyn brigade criticise the polices that led to the improved result at the last general election. Yet they never offer alternative policies.

    What would you have us do, John? Go back to the failed policies of Thatcher? Go back to the failed policies of Blair (NHS privatisation, PFI, lunatic military interventions etc.)?

    Take those policies to the electorate and you’ll find yourself polling below the Elvis Loves Pets party.

    Laughably, the Blairites won’t shut-up but neither will they put-up.

  23. John Wall says:

    @Steve – I’m not on the left and have never voted Labour, even under Blair.

  24. Jenny Murray says:

    The IMF support Labours tax plans. The billionaire Governer of Missouri raised taxes in 2011 for the wealthy and the economy improved immeasurably!

  25. John Wall says:

    @Jenny Murray – the IMF report doesn’t say that

  26. H Farm says:

    This is getting so depressing. It’s like the election didn’t happen for you guys. Out in the real world almost every commentator across the spectrum thinks labour and corbyn are in a vastly better position and likely to win the next election. Corbyn has beaten May decisively in PMQs three weeks in a row and defeated the government in a universal credit vote and labour are 3-5 points ahead in most polls but for you guys it’s as if we’re still in March with labour below 30%.

    I mean seriously what is the point in writing this bitter angry piece with no suggestions on how labour could improve and no recognition that your claims that corbyn would lead labour to a huge defeat were totally wrong.

  27. steve says:

    John Wall: “I’m not on the left and have never voted Labour, even under Blair.”

    Ok. Where do I have to go to find the policies you do support?

  28. John Wall says:

    @Steve – I’m a low tax, small government type.

    @H Farm – From my point of view I have no interest in seeing Corbychev in No. 10. However, if you look at the polls overall you’ll find that the Labour lead, yes there is one, averages between 2 and 3 per cent and the most recent poll I saw a couple of days ago had both on 42%. That sort of lead would probably make Labour the largest party – but not give an overall majority. To get an overall majority you probably need a lead of at least 6-7% – and Corbychev isn’t achieving that. The vote on Universal Credit was won because Conservative MPs were whipped to not turn up. I’m not happy – along with many – with UC, and completely agree that 20% dissatisfaction is unacceptable. However, the mood music is that the Government is looking at changes – and the obvious one is cutting the time for payment which would solve a lot of problems. Very few people watch PMQs and I certainly don’t believe that May will lead the Conservatives into the next election.

  29. H Farm says:

    @ John Wall yes but your not even claiming to support labour while this blog claims to be labour uncut I don’t expect you to be pleased about a labour gov but I do expect the blairites who predicted labour would go down to a major defeat to be pleased they haven’t.

    In terms of your other points

    Polling: Britain elects poll of polls is 3.5% lead for labour right now which if translated as a general swing wld probably give lab a very small majority or else a choice of governing with SNP or Lib Dem support. That may sound bad but given no party has won more than a 12 seat majority since 2005 and the fact that most of the smaller parties will be far more inclined to support a labour as opposed to conservative government I’d say it’s pretty good.

    Universal credit: no the government lost that vote as John Bercow said. The fact that they are now treating parliament with contempt by refusing to vote on the opposition motions shows their weakness not their strength.

    Finally yes PMQs May not be watched by many but they do set a tone of what’s going on and who’s winning and right now Corbyn is doing very well in them to the point of forcing changes in policy. The tories will probably replace May (although brexit could bring her gov down before they get a chance) but any new leader will face the same problems and many of the front runners Boris & Davis are pretty poisonous to many people while of the more moderate candidates Rudd would struggle to hold her seat and Davidson isn’t an mp

  30. John Wall says:

    @H Farm – the Blairites can speak for themselves !

    I’ve seen predictions that Labour could be the largest party – but those in the know say at least 6-7% for an overall majority. Remember that all the polls have a margin of error of something like +/- 3%.

    Do you really want to be in bed with either the LDs or the SNP ?

    The LDs were almost wiped out in 2015 – irrespective of tuition fees that was always going to happen as they’d prospered by being a party of protest and all things to all men, and women! They couldn’t get the anti-establishment vote when they were in government. Even assuming they were interested, what would their pound of flesh be ? PR ? Although some may talk about it you end up with the tail wagging the dog, whereas FPTP means that the two main parties get power every so often.

    And what about the SNP ? Indyref2 ? Eight DUP MPs extracted quite a lot, what would somewhat more SNP MPs want ? And what would Scottish Labour have to say about a deal with the SNP ? These things are far from straightforward.

    I watch PMQs and May has been doing OK imho – but I’m assuming that she won’t be there for the next election. As to her replacement, Cameron came out of nowhere….

  31. John Wall says:

    In the late 1990s William Hague regularly knocked spots off Blair at PMQs – Blair still won in 2001….

  32. steve says:

    John Wall: “I’m a low tax, small government type.”

    I get it now. Those who run this blog have given up on attempting to offer a Corbyn alternative and instead are commissioning pointless provocations.

  33. John P Reid says:

    John wall think it’s 6% to get a overall majority, but djng think rhd libdems would go j tk coalition, rhd other point is that Ukips 2 remajbjnv percent would almost certainly go Tory if it’s voters felt labour was gonna win.

    Take next year council elections see how thd Tories do in Chingford or Ruskin or Harrow, ukip did well there 4 years ago

  34. Anne says:

    John, as a paid up member of the Labour Party, and one who keeps both a close eye and ear to political developments, if Labour are not able to achieve a majority in the next election, and I hope this would be sooner rather than later, I would have no objection to having a working relationship with the Lib Dem’s. This would be a far more favourable then one the Tories have the dup – I find very little that I would want to support from this party.
    Teresa May’s lot are doing long term damage to our economy with their approach to Brexit. At least JC was honest enough to say he voted Reman in the referendum and if asked to vote again he would vote Remain again as he has heard nothing to convince him that leave is beneficial for our country. Listen to what Keir Starmer and Francis O’Grady are saying – jobs first
    I read today that Mementum are going into Boris’ constituency – I wish them well.

  35. John Wall says:

    @Anne – would the LDs want to get in bed with anybody again? They had a bit of a recovery after 2015 and the referendum but did badly in this year’s local and general elections. Although they increased their MPs it was on a lower %age share. They’re happiest as a party of protest where they can just make promises they don’t have to keep. As for Brexit it would be absolutely disastrous if Corbychev, et al were in charge – as damaging as what he’d do to the economy if he got into No. 10. It’s well documented how the position on various things changes more often than some change their socks and it’s clear that they’d take anything, however poor, offered.

  36. Vern says:

    Anne, if you believe Corbyn you are on a sticky wicket from the outset. I will remind you again-Corbyn (a man in his sixties) sat on the floor of a train and blatantly lied about there being no seats. It might sound trivial until you look into the psyche of the individual.

    Corbyn was against the EU from it’s outset and consistently voted against it throughout his career as political no-mark.
    Had he remained true to himself,( instead of voting for the opposite of what the Tories do out of spite) then I believe he would have voted to leave and many million more lemmings would have voted with him and voted leave too.

    Regardless of how you think the Tories are doing, Brexit is about business first and that is the Tories domain. Corbyn and Labour don’t even have a settled position on Brexit because they haven’t got a clue what’s going on.

    And Momentum is a truck load of angry youngsters fuelled by Labours lies. Fully costed manifestos was more lies, removing University fees-more lies again. A kinder fairer politics – the biggest lie of all. Preaching division and hate.

    Corbyn has earned £2m + out of the public purse-he is the few, not the many but he has lied to you and millions more to make you think otherwise.

    Time for everyone to wake up and time for Momentum to grow up.

  37. Tafia says:

    At least JC was honest enough to say he voted Reman in the referendum and if asked to vote again he would vote Remain again as he has heard nothing to convince him that leave is beneficial for our country

    If you believe that you are an idiot. He has only recently stated this after refusing to comment for over a year. His history regarding the EU however is easily available on-line. Since being an MP he has voted against every single piece of EU legislation brought before the House including the Maastricht and Lisbon Treaties.

    And I shall reproduce a section from Labour’s Manifesto of the Generak Election of this year, a posigion approved by Comrade Corbychev:-
    Labour accepts the referendum result

    So Anne, you think the Labour Party was telling the truth or deliberately lying?
    2. Do you accept the Labour Party stated position or do you oppose the Labour Party.

    This would be a far more favourable then one the Tories have the dup – I find very little that I would want to support from this party.
    As for the DUP, back in 2010 just after the election Ed Balls – on behalf of Ed Miliband and with the knowledge of the NEC, was in direct negotiation with the DUP to join a rainbow coalition.

    For a member of the Labour Party your lack of knowledge of what your Party is uo to is absolutely comical,.

  38. buttley says:

    Vern says: “I will remind you again-Corbyn (a man in his sixties) sat on the floor of a train and blatantly lied about there being no seats.”

    Except the Freedom of Information request, which Branson sat on for seven months, proved that Corbyn, was telling the truth.

    Which kinda defeats, your “psyche of the individual” psycho-babble.

  39. John Wall says:

    It’s important to understand how train seat reservations work.

    The carriages shown use the old system where cards are put on the seat – more recent trains have electronic displays.

    In either case the operation is the same – the reservations are all identified at the start of the journey.

    If, for example, a train is going from London to Edinburgh with a number of stops a reservation between, say, York and Edinburgh will be identified at Kings Cross – but the seat will be empty until York. So, if you get on at Kings Cross without a reservation and you’re only going as far as York – or a stop further south – you need to read the cards and there isn’t a problem occupying a seat with a card on it that reserves it from York onwards.

    As tickets can be very cheap if booked a long time in advance some book tickets on several trains – and reservations can be free – if they’re unsure exactly when they’re traveling. So, you might get on at Kings Cross without a reservation and all you have to do is wait for the train to start and then start reading the reservation cards on the empty seats and you’ll probably find one where the passenger hasn’t turned up.

  40. Vern says:

    Buttley, the video shows loads of empty seats but this reinforces my point. The video is a good example of Labour’s approach under Corbyn and McDonell whipping up hate and division. The old cliché that “if you say something for long enough people will eventually believe you” springs to mind with this brand of politics.

  41. buttley says:

    Vern says: ” Labour’s approach under Corbyn and McDonnell whipping up hate and division.”

    Who are they hating against?

    Who are they dividing?

    “the video shows loads of empty seats” & then it shows, they were in fact, all occupied, the point of the freedom of information request.

    So how exactly did Corbyn blatantly lie?

  42. John Wall says:

    There was nothing preventing Corbychev sitting – but not on the floor.

  43. Landless Peasant says:

    Under Corbyn & McDonnell Labour are finally getting their act together and the future seems bright & promising. I just wish Labour would make its mind up where they stand on Universal Credit, do they still think it’s a good idea, or like the rest of us, do they recognize that it is the over ambitious workings of an unhinged egotistical mad man (IDS) & it should be scrapped altogether?

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